- Thread starter angel
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Hi Angel,
I have heard of "factory" GPL R4's, but I think you're right, it's for GTL models. I've posted this very question before on the forum but no one seemed to know anything. I will be very interested to hear if you managed to fit a GPL system to your 845, I was seriously thinking of doing the same.
I have heard of "factory" GPL R4's, but I think you're right, it's for GTL models. I've posted this very question before on the forum but no one seemed to know anything. I will be very interested to hear if you managed to fit a GPL system to your 845, I was seriously thinking of doing the same.
angel
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It is possible to fit such a system on the small engine (in fact on any Otto engine!), and it should be no different than the factory 1100s. The reason I am asking is why we have not heard of it on an 845cc engine? Maybe because torque/power losses of about 4% common when converting a carburetted engine to GPL are too much for the small engines?
angel
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It is actually for a friend's R4 not mine.
We were thinking to put the tank on the spare wheel position, that was the solution used on the factory GPL R4s.
There is no need to install an ECU and Lambda probe. Millions of GPL equipped cars run fine without these. But of course, it would run better if so equipped, and even better if it had mapped ignition. But I think we are going too far ahead...
We were thinking to put the tank on the spare wheel position, that was the solution used on the factory GPL R4s.
There is no need to install an ECU and Lambda probe. Millions of GPL equipped cars run fine without these. But of course, it would run better if so equipped, and even better if it had mapped ignition. But I think we are going too far ahead...
mr-reno-139
AKA Paul Cunningham
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slightly off topic but relevant maybe
had a megane turn up the other day which had hydrogen fuel cell under bonnet very strange allegedly gives more power and 30% more mpg
theory is top it up with water and the cars 12v supply produce hydrogen which is fed straight into the induction system
dubious ??
had a megane turn up the other day which had hydrogen fuel cell under bonnet very strange allegedly gives more power and 30% more mpg
theory is top it up with water and the cars 12v supply produce hydrogen which is fed straight into the induction system
dubious ??
Hehe, Mr Reno, I'm checking the date to make sure it's not April 1st!. I think the chap who has the Megane is about to become a very very rich man if he has a simple hydrogen fuel cell up and working!!!. Could it have been a water injection system?. Did you get any photo's?.
Mr Reno,
I stand corrected!, just been looking at all the Ebay ads for hydrogen convertions, and they are out there!. I think it is basically a water injection system they're punting the plans for, but I have to say it's caught my imagination, might invest the £1.99 for the CD!.
I stand corrected!, just been looking at all the Ebay ads for hydrogen convertions, and they are out there!. I think it is basically a water injection system they're punting the plans for, but I have to say it's caught my imagination, might invest the £1.99 for the CD!.
nicky4tl
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carry on off topic
I wasted a few days looking at videos on youtube and reading up on these DIY hydrogen carryon stuff. I'm not a physicist but... are these things not defying some serious laws of physics? More current is requested from the alternator to produce hydrogen by splitting water. therefore more petrol must be burned as the magnetic field is increased.
The splitting of water liberates oxygen as well which isn't used so there's an immediate source of loss. Its a bit too close to a perpetual motion machine for me though the bubbles look pretty.
I wasted a few days looking at videos on youtube and reading up on these DIY hydrogen carryon stuff. I'm not a physicist but... are these things not defying some serious laws of physics? More current is requested from the alternator to produce hydrogen by splitting water. therefore more petrol must be burned as the magnetic field is increased.
The splitting of water liberates oxygen as well which isn't used so there's an immediate source of loss. Its a bit too close to a perpetual motion machine for me though the bubbles look pretty.
Azazello
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Here in Italy GPL on r4 is quite a common choice, and th r4 park is made principally of 845 and later 956, a few 1108, while I see in UK the GTL version is more diffused.
845 r4 are known to run very well with GPL.
I was thinking to install GPL on my 956... There is a government contribute, I will pay the transformation about 750 euros...
845 r4 are known to run very well with GPL.
I was thinking to install GPL on my 956... There is a government contribute, I will pay the transformation about 750 euros...
Azazello
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Indeed.
I do not like the other stuff that will populate my engine bay (I like r4 even for the basic equipment it has, that permitted working even an ignorant like me).
But I want to use my car, not to leave it in the garage because of the cost of gasoline...
I do not like the other stuff that will populate my engine bay (I like r4 even for the basic equipment it has, that permitted working even an ignorant like me).
But I want to use my car, not to leave it in the garage because of the cost of gasoline...
angel
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A word of caution to anyone planning an LPG conversion...
Renault officially provided the LPG option in the late 70s / early 80s on the 1108 engine, but among the necessary conversion parts, they also listed a different cylinder head and exhaust valves.
This must had been because LPG promotes valve seat recession and/or exhaust valve burning more rapidly than unleaded petrol. With LPG we can burn much leaner mixtures as the mixture is by definition more homogenous (no droplets to atomize and spread uniformly in the combustion chamber here...). In fact, all LPG systems are being set lean, to offset a bit the higher lt/hr consumption of LPG versus petrol (expected, as LPG has a lower thermal power than petrol).
Add to this the fact that there is no liquid vaporization inside the combustion chamber (a useful side effect of petrol, that lowers combustion temperatures) and you may see that exhaust valves and seats have a hard life...
This may not be the cause with Andrea's engine (low compression), but it may be a problem on a GTL.
Note that all LPG conversion kit manufacturers list various valve problems (exhaust, but also inlet in some cases!) that appeared in modern engines, when using LPG without valve / seat modifications, some of them after the first 30.000 or so kilometers.
Renault officially provided the LPG option in the late 70s / early 80s on the 1108 engine, but among the necessary conversion parts, they also listed a different cylinder head and exhaust valves.
This must had been because LPG promotes valve seat recession and/or exhaust valve burning more rapidly than unleaded petrol. With LPG we can burn much leaner mixtures as the mixture is by definition more homogenous (no droplets to atomize and spread uniformly in the combustion chamber here...). In fact, all LPG systems are being set lean, to offset a bit the higher lt/hr consumption of LPG versus petrol (expected, as LPG has a lower thermal power than petrol).
Add to this the fact that there is no liquid vaporization inside the combustion chamber (a useful side effect of petrol, that lowers combustion temperatures) and you may see that exhaust valves and seats have a hard life...
This may not be the cause with Andrea's engine (low compression), but it may be a problem on a GTL.
Note that all LPG conversion kit manufacturers list various valve problems (exhaust, but also inlet in some cases!) that appeared in modern engines, when using LPG without valve / seat modifications, some of them after the first 30.000 or so kilometers.