Reasons why R4 lean to side in the curve

[Grenuj]

What is the technical reasons why 4 leans??
Is it r4 on the road balanced car?
Is it an indication that there is a problem somewhere? The nature of our chassis?
Torsions, shock absorbers, etc etc..

 

[Jnr-Renospeed]

It's pretty much in the Renault 4's nature to lean over in corners; it has long travel suspension, supple shock absorbers, high profile tyres with skinny wheels, a higher centre of gravity than the likes of a Hillman Imp or Mini and a lot of models do not have rear anti-roll bars which can combat lean a good deal. Also due to their age they likely have a bit of chassis twist.

In many period reviews and current classic car reviews the reviewer often marvels at how well the 4 holds onto the road whilst leaning very far over during cornering and how far you can push the level of grip. They do feel like you can have the door handles scraping on the road before they lose grip.

Sagging torsion bars will make your car feel unnecessarily 'floppy' and if your car has been lowered the torsion bars become softer so raising the ride height will make your car somewhat stiffer.

 

[angel]

A comment on center of gravity: it's not as high as one may believe, considering the height of the body. The body and doors and what sits over the chassis is very light and the glasses are small. What has to be relatively heavy - the chassis - is located roughly at wheel centerline level.

 

[John Edmonds]

What is the technical reasons why 4 leans??
Is it r4 on the road balanced car?
Is it an indication that there is a problem somewhere? The nature of our chassis?
Torsions, shock absorbers, etc etc..

Great photos! The white R4 clearly demonstrates roll and understeer, whereas the red R4 is well-balanced with roll (lean) countered by a neutral steering attitude and a delicate application of throttle. With all the softly-suspended French cars (R4, 2CV), roll is progressive and an appropriate safety deterrent, but such fun to drive. Interesting also to note that both R4s are LHD with the driver (80kg? this is over 10% of the unladen vehicle weight) on the outside of the corner, which will further accentuate the 'lean'. Roadholding (ie grip) is very good for such narrow tyres (135-80x13), but as Angel has pointed out the C of G is relatively low for such a tall car. Enjoy the supple ride! Heavenly compared to a '60's Mini...

 

[John Edmonds]

Great photos! The white R4 clearly demonstrates roll and understeer, whereas the red R4 is well-balanced with roll (lean) countered by a neutral steering attitude and a delicate application of throttle. With all the softly-suspended French cars (R4, 2CV), roll is progressive and an appropriate safety deterrent, but such fun to drive. Interesting also to note that both R4s are LHD with the driver (80kg? this is over 10% of the unladen vehicle weight) on the outside of the corner, which will further accentuate the 'lean'. Roadholding (ie grip) is very good for such narrow tyres (135-80x13), but as Angel has pointed out the C of G is relatively low for such a tall car. Enjoy the supple ride! Heavenly compared to a '60's Mini...

You also may be interested to note the super-lightweight electric Renault Twizzy uses 145-80x13 tyres (ie wider than the 135-80x13 on most R4) on 3-stud alloy wheels that appear to be the same PCD(?) as the R4?

 

[Jnr-Renospeed]

You also may be interested to note the super-lightweight electric Renault Twizzy uses 145-80x13 tyres (ie wider than the 135-80x13 on most R4) on 3-stud alloy wheels that appear to be the same PCD(?) as the R4?

The PCD doesn't match up for the Twizy and R4, I believe they (Twizy) are the same PCD as a Smart, also it's personal taste but those Twizy wheels on a 4 would look bloody terrible .
I believe Grenuj already has Gordini Turbo alloys on his car with 145s which they mentioned in another thread, so he already has wider tyres though not the widest you could fit .

 

[laxeian]

Good info, just saved me 30 mins or more playing with photoshop to see , then possibly even more searching breaker sites

 

[John Edmonds]

The PCD doesn't match up for the Twizy and R4, I believe they (Twizy) are the same PCD as a Smart, also it's personal taste but those Twizy wheels on a 4 would look bloody terrible .
I believe Grenuj already has Gordini Turbo alloys on his car with 145s which they mentioned in another thread, so he already has wider tyres though not the widest you could fit .

I agree the Twizzy wheels would look awful on the R4, but thought the standard steel R4 wheels (plain, unperforated) could be really cool on the Twizzy!

 

[Grenuj]

I believe Grenuj already has Gordini Turbo alloys on his car with 145s which they mentioned in another thread, so he already has wider tyres though not the widest you could fit

Yes, I have ..but unfortunately not a wider tire (refers to electric Renault, not wider than Twizzy). I posted a topic.. in my case there is no space, they touch each other (tyres and s rack outer).

 

[Leonardo.IT]

It does roll, but it doesen't mean poor handling or stability, those cars (and even more the 2cvs) were famous for rolling without flipping over.

 

[JdeW]

Yes, I have .

Great Alpine Turbo alloys

 

[Piet]

The other reason it rolls so much is suspension geometry- the roll centre for the trailing arm set up is at ground level. Adding an anti- roll bar at the rear works wonders, but at the detriment of ride.